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Xen-
11-04-2003, 01:13 PM
Ok I'm doing it. I'm giving up matched grip for trad grip. It's not because Virgil is doing it, which is still a good argument, but I do get a better balance this way. The problem with that is obviously the technique I need to develop. Do you have any tips on how to be succesful with it and avoid injuries? Thanks!

peter
11-04-2003, 01:33 PM
Oh, Xen...

I don't think it's a good idea BUT
since I can do it and did for many
years before switching over to
matched, I will try and help.

The area between the thumb and
index finger is where you will have
to focus. You have to lock that stick
in place and it has to stay in place,
if you hope to get a round the kit
with any speed. It's not easy but
I would focus there.

Practice all your rudiments and other
routines, with this in mind. It's got
to be hard enough to lock but not
hard enough to strain the muscles.

By the way, hold the stick towards
the middle, lightening the load. The
closer to the end you hold them, the
harder it will be on your hand, though
that's where I generally hold them,
unless I am back-sticking.

Good luck. :)

Milo Porto
11-04-2003, 02:00 PM
Originally posted by Xen-
Ok I'm doing it. I'm giving up matched grip for trad grip. It's not because Virgil is doing it, which is still a good argument, but I do get a better balance this way. The problem with that is obviously the technique I need to develop. Do you have any tips on how to be succesful with it and avoid injuries? Thanks!

Xen- if you've been playing match grip for most of your playing life...stick to it..dont change it...!!;)

just my two cents!

DavidPartay
11-04-2003, 05:11 PM
Practise mixing double strokes in with single strokes.

You need to do that a lot to help gain control and comfort with it.

Work on backbeats WITHOUT doing rimshots at first until you fill comfortable hitting reasonably loud back beats, and then start practising using rimshots. I can do quite impressive rimshots now, because I practised as simply and directly as I could. I've still gotta work with keeping the power at higher speeds though.

But definitely, DEFINITELY work on rudiments, and practise your double strokes rolls like nothing else!!!

BrettLee
11-04-2003, 06:34 PM
It is definitely an extension for a drummer to know more than one grip.. Neither one is better than the other, but some do offer some kinda flexibility around the kit.. Learning all the common grips is useful indeed.. I'm also now using trad grip alot(with my practise pad :D) and learning how to handle the sticks, just like how Vinnie does it.. Does anyone here find Vinnie's gripping abit different than other trad grippers?

Lucius
11-04-2003, 09:58 PM
I havnt really noticed much of a difference with his grip compared to others, but one thing i know, is that Vinne is an absolute monster, and is a VERY underated drummer!

timthedrummer
11-05-2003, 06:51 PM
i tend to agree lucius, but there is an 'aura' about him
its so cool how everyone here is so postive :D
(sorry just my observations on everyones replies) :D

alencore
11-05-2003, 10:25 PM
whatever grip you use that suits your best performance overall will always be the deciding factor. match grip is my serious playing grip then i would fool around to t grip just to relieve muscles on my left on softer songs or swinging jazzy stuff.

btw - VD is not underated, may be not too popular to some but He is way too popular now especially to double bass freaks.

Lucius
11-06-2003, 02:59 PM
VD?

Xen-
11-06-2003, 03:02 PM
Vligri Ditano

Lucius
11-06-2003, 06:33 PM
hahaha, i was questioning the VD because we were (or at least i was) talking about VC! (Vinnie Colaiuta) :D

MaltBuddow3
11-16-2003, 08:25 AM
I seriously dont recommend switching! My Dad did, and he's going thru some serious playing difficulties right now. Those can of course be avoided thru stretching and stuff, but think of the muscle groups. Dont take this for exact numbers, but I think: Matched- 13 muscle groups working for you, Trad- 3 groups... that's a huge difference.

timthedrummer
11-16-2003, 03:27 PM
yeh good point
only switch if u have the patience to develop it as well...
it's can get really frustrating and make u feel like ur crap at first
but hey its all part of the process ;)

Lucius
11-16-2003, 04:00 PM
Tims 100% right, plus, there is a lot that 3 muscles can do!!! I dont think we use all of our 13 in the matched grip side to its full potential, i think we can develop them to create a balance, just look at Lang, Virg and Vinnie, they have quite a niec balance between their grips there! :D

Xen-
11-16-2003, 04:30 PM
Ok right now I'm doing both. Matched is still WAY better, but I plan on using a grip depending on the musical situation. When I'm practicing on a pad, which happens quite often, I'm doing traditional only. Practicing rudiments was horrible when I started... Heh :) Still haven't found a position for the snare I'm comfortable with with the two grips, though.

Adam
11-17-2003, 08:57 AM
Xen-

You'll probably want your snare as flat as possible and quite high up if you're doing both traditional and matched. For me (I switched a while back from matched to traditional) it's just a matter of sticking with it, and only playing it until you've got it right. When I had started, I'd sit down behind my kit and want to wank around and solo, so I'd try it with trad and then want to switch back because I couldn't do anything. The only thing I can say is only switch if you have the dicipline/patience to play 100% traditional all the time until you have it as good as matched.

Hip Alien
11-18-2003, 07:59 PM
It's all a question of what 'feels' better for you in whatever style you're playing. I saw Gary Novak 'live' last weekend playing 'bop', matched grip.....

Xen-
12-03-2003, 05:53 PM
Hello. After those weeks of practice I've found out that when playing on the snare, I'm getting a better sound while using trad. grip. That means when I'm playing a backbeat, the subtle ghosts/buzzes in it have way more definition, which adds musicality. When playing on toms, cymbals, or when moving around alot, matched is more precise and powerful.

I think both grips have huge advantages so I'll develop them equally. Now I only have to find a way not to drop :rolleyes: the sticks when changing grip quickly.

Thanks to everyone's tips.

peter
12-04-2003, 03:22 AM
I think that part of issue is where the
stick is being held. When drummers play
matched, they're usuall much lower than
where they are traditional.

If you held your sticks up (closer to the
middle of the stick), while matched, your
stroke will approximate trad more.

I don't want this to be an argument a-
bout which is better but an investigation
into the observations we've each had,
while we've tried each of the grips.

When you 'drop' the stick on the drum,
the stick is doing a lot of the work and
there's a 'relaxed-ness' about that that
we find very appealing.

Consider the right-hand. Does it ever
feel that relaxed? What about the left-
hand on any other drum, than the snare,
which is right in front of you? Does it ev-
er feel as relaxed as when it strikes the
snare drum? The answer to that quest-
ion might do very well to illustrate ex-
actly what Xen is saying.

I would investigate changing the matched
grip before moving to trad and again, I
am a drummer who played trad for over 25-
years and I switched. I don't think people
do this enough.

Here are the 4 basic alternatives:

1. You can move from French to German grip.
2. You can move from German to French grip.
3. You can move the fulcrum up the stick.
4. You can move the fulcrum down the stick.

Remember that when you drop the stick
trad, there is nothing countering the stroke
on the bottom of the stick. To approximate
this, you will have to allow the stick to 'play'
underneath your thumb and index finger,
while matched. In other words, your ring
and pinky will have to have minimal contact
with the stick after the stroke, much like the
trad, when the stick is 'dropped'.

It can be done. It's about choices. Try it and
see if you can't feel better about it. :)